Help me understand. Abortion = Murder but Death Penalty ≠ Murder??

First, a word from God himself on abortions (Genesis 6:6-7):

In Exodus 12:29, God the baby-killer slaughters all Egyptian firstborn children and cattle because their king was stubborn.


When life begins according to the Bible

A women in my local newspapers makes an interesting point about when life begins according to the Bible and quotes a few sections. I had never heard this and thought it was quite interesting.

Read your Bible

It's been my experience that Christians often know less about the Bible than non-Christians. This certainly seems to be the case when it comes to their claims about life beginning at conception, an idea that they think comes from the Bible.

Actually, the Bible teaches that a fetus is not a living person with a soul until after it draws its first breath.

After God formed man in Genesis 2:7, He "breathed into his nostrils the breath of life and it was then that the man became a living being." Although the man was fully formed by God in all respects, he was not a living being until after taking his first breath.

Job 33:4 states: "The spirit of God has made me, and the breath of the Almighty gives me life."

Ezekiel 37:5: "Thus says the Lord God to these bones: Behold, I will cause breath to enter you, and you shall live."

Exodus 21:22 states that if a man causes a woman to have a miscarriage, he shall be fined; however, if the woman dies, then he will be put to death. If the aborted fetus were a living human being, wouldn't the punishment be equal?

Harsh laws against abortion, which are causing so much misery for women in sensitive situations, are not based on the Bible, but on emotional thinking and bad faith. They are being used to rally votes from gullible people.

If only Christians would read their Bibles.

-- Evan Fisher


The Catholic church will not baptize a full term still born child that a mother gave birth to. Not only will they not baptize the baby, they WILL NOT allow the baby to have a funeral mass. Reason is that the baby never took a breath. Tell me how the Catholic church believes life begins at conception.



Apparently, abortions stifle the domestic supply of infants . I didn't know infants were part of the supply chain.

So what if a 16 year old tried to adopt a baby? She can't, she's not mature or financially stable enough to adopt a baby. But if she's pregnant, she has to raise that baby. Tell me how this makes sense,

There is something so insidious, so heinous about referring to children as a domestic supply, like they are tubs of margarine or paper straws or chapstick.

Planned Parenthood is the nation's largest provider of birth control, meaning they are literaly doing more than anyone else to prevent abortions.

If abortion is illegal then a man leaving a girl who's pregnant should be illegal too, if women can't back out of pregnancy neither should men.

This argument is built on the idea that that women who don't want to be pregnant should just SUCK IT UP for 9 months so that other families can make their adoption dreams come true. And it makes a twisted kind of sense in the minds of Coney Barrett and Alito. After all, America is built on the backs of low paid workers whose tireless production lines the pockets of the wealthy.

Life doesn't begin at conception, it begins before conception. A sperm cell is alive, an egg cell is alive, a zygote is alive and a fetus is alive.


Of Course the Constitution Has Nothing to Say About Abortion

There is absolutely nothing in the U.S. Constution or in the circumstances under which it was written - that suggests its authors imagined women as part of the political community embraced by the phrase "We the People." There were no women among the delegates to the Constitutional Convention. There were no women among the hundreds of people who participated in ratifying conventions in the states. There were no women judges. There were no women legislators. At the time, women could neither hold office nor run for office, and, except in New Jersey, and then only fleetingly, women could not vote. Legally, most women did not exist as persons.



If any of you pro lifers get tape worms you better suck it up and be a good host, because tape worms have a heartbeat and feel pain. It deserves a choice and it chose you to be its mother.


FFRF God is not so pro-life

A prominent fundamentalist Christian minister and television celebrity regularly proclaims that the unborn child has a God-given right to life, that life is a gift from God, and that abortion is the sinful destruction of God's sacred creation. These and similar assertions are thoroughly refuted by "God's word," the holy bible.

Defenders of women's reproductive rights should know what the bible actually says about abortion and, by extension, related issues, including contraception, the morning-after pill, in vitro fertilization and fetal tissue research.

Scriptural Truths

Ten biblical episodes and prophecies provide an unequivocal expression of God's attitude toward human life, especially the ontological status of "unborn children" and their pregnant mothers-to-be. Brief summaries:

  • A pregnant woman who is injured and aborts the fetus warrants financial compensation only (to her husband), suggesting that the fetus is property, not a person (Exodus 21:22-25).

  • The gruesome priestly purity test to which a wife accused of adultery must submit will cause her to abort the fetus if she is guilty, indicating that the fetus does not possess a right to life (Numbers 5:11-31).

  • God enumerated his punishments for disobedience, including "cursed shall be the fruit of your womb" and "you will eat the fruit of your womb," directly contradicting sanctity-of-life claims (Deuteronomy 28:18,53).

  • Elisha's prophecy for soon-to-be King Hazael said he would attack the Israelites, burn their cities, crush the heads of their babies and rip open their pregnant women (2 Kings 8:12).

  • King Menahem of Israel destroyed Tiphsah (also called Tappuah) and the surrounding towns, killing all residents and ripping open pregnant women with the sword (2 Kings 15:16).

  • Isaiah prophesied doom for Babylon, including the murder of unborn children: "They will have no pity on the fruit of the womb" (Isaiah 13:18).

  • For worshiping idols, God declared that not one of his people would live, not a man, woman or child (not even babies in arms), again confuting assertions about the sanctity of life (Jeremiah 44:7-8).

  • God will punish the Israelites by destroying their unborn children who will die at birth, or perish in the womb, or never even be conceived (Hosea 9:10-16).

  • For rebelling against God, Samaria's people will be killed, their babies will be dashed to death against the ground, and their pregnant women will be ripped open with a sword (Hosea 13:16).

  • Jesus did not express any special concern for unborn children during the anticipated end times: "Woe to pregnant women and those who are nursing" (Matthew 24:19). Biblical Atrocities

    The 10 incidents and declarations surveyed above document God's complete rejection of the anti-abortion crusaders' claims about the sanctity of life and a divine right to life. There is clearly no biblical justification for the radical theology they espouse. This section summarizes God's monumental history of murderous behavior as recorded in holy writ.

    We know that God killed millions of unborn children and their pregnant mothers-to-be in the Noachian deluge, the conquest of Canaan, the incineration of Sodom and Gomorrah and in 20 major slaughters described in the bible. The critical feature of these horrific events is that all people were exterminated. Whenever entire communities were massacred, we can be sure that pregnant mothers-to-be and their unborn children were among the victims. Moreover, there are no stated exemptions for this specific segment of the population.

    It can be concluded from this ghastly program of human annihilation that the God of the bible is the greatest mass murderer in history and that he does not care about unborn children or living children or living adults. If God really opposes abortion, why didn't he just say so? Why didn't he authorize one of his trusted spokesmen-Moses, Jesus or Paul-to issue a definitive statement on the subject?

    It is also noteworthy that while the bible requires the death penalty for 60 specified criminal violations, abortion is not among them. When all relevant documentation is examined, it is obvious that God does not love the unborn and he certainly does not disapprove of abortion.

    Theological Questions

    Anti-abortion zealots assert that human life begins at conception, and therefore the fertilized egg possesses all constitutional rights of a living person. It follows that destruction of a conceived embryo (blastocyst) is murder.This is the basis for the personhood argument which has been defeated in five statewide initiatives since 2010.

    The bible declares that God breathed life into man's body (Genesis 2:7). At least a dozen more verses indicate that breath is synonymous with life. This scriptural truth completely contradicts the personhood dogma.

    More importantly, if the fertilized ovum is a person, as anti-abortion extremists claim, then God's record as the greatest murderer of unborn children is expanded further. That is because most fertilized eggs either fail to implant in the uterine wall and pass out of the body or do implant, begin to develop and then are spontaneously aborted. Fewer than one-third of fertilized ova survive to become living humans.

    Why does God murder untold millions of these "persons" every year in the U.S. alone? Why did God, who allegedly loves the unborn and hates abortion, kill so many unborn children, adolescents and adults throughout biblical history? Why do fundamentalists pursue a political agenda that is thoroughly refuted by God's word?

    Anti-abortion antilogies

    Among those who deny women's reproductive rights, numerous contradictory positions are observed. For example, some prominent politicians who want to overturn Roe v. Wade would allow exceptions for rape, incest, severe fetal abnormality and/or life of the mother. These exceptions necessarily require destroying the fetus, which is the very action they condemn. In other words, the murder of unborn children is acceptable when anti-abortion politicians approve.

    Another blatant inconsistency involves physicians who want to defund Planned Parenthood because it provides aborted fetuses for medical research. Yet, some of these physicians have themselves conducted research using aborted fetuses. Furthermore, medical investigations using fetal tissue have produced lifesaving vaccines and therapeutic interventions that have benefited everyone.

    The most disgusting contradiction exists between the radical activists' preferred label "pro-life" and their horrific record of godly violence. In the 40 years since Roe v. Wade, was decided, eight abortion providers have been murdered and 17 have been maimed or seriously injured. More than 6,000 acts of violence have been perpetrated, including fire bombings, arsons, kidnappings, assaults and death threats. These agents of violence are accurately labeled "Christian terrorists."

    The activists who want to make abortion illegal invariably call themselves "Christian conservatives," stating that they want to reduce government intrusion and eliminate burdensome regulations that limit personal liberty. They say they want to get government off our backs and out of our lives. Except, of course, when they want to use the coercive power of government to inflict their theological beliefs on everybody else, especially in matters of reproduction and sexuality.

    After 40 years with at least 1 million elective abortions annually, opponents still refuse to endorse programs that are proven to reduce abortions, such as family planning that stresses contraception and comprehensive sexuality education.

    Instead they promote abstinence-only, ignorance curricula. If they would focus their efforts on preventing unwanted pregnancies, they would stop many more abortions than their politically coercive and sometimes violent tactics have stopped. Ironically, the crusaders help to cause the abortions they denounce.

    A 'Holocaust'

    Dogmatists condemn what they call the "holocaust" of 56 million abortions since Roe v. Wade became the law of the land. At the same time, they spend tens of billions of dollars annually building and operating their grandiose megachurches, Christian academies and other programs to promote fundamentalist doctrines. If they really want to prevent the murder of unborn children, why don't they just use some of their vast wealth to pay women not to have abortions?

    Lastly, the most egregious contradiction occurs whenever the religionists invoke a biblical justification for their sanctimonious stance, because the Judeo-Christian God simply does not care about the lives of pregnant women and their unborn children. Abortion opponents cite a dozen verses that refer to the developing fetus but not one that condemns abortion.

    The bible is an unending compilation of atrocities illustrating God's penchant for feticide, infanticide and the wholesale slaughter of adults.

    Conclusion

    Prominent women's rights groups like Planned Parenthood, the Religious Coalition for Reproductive Choice, NARAL Pro-choice America, Emily's List and the National Organization for Women should confront the zealots about the complete lack of biblical support for their position. For the past decade, surveys have indicated that about two-thirds of Americans think abortion should remain legal. A 2015 poll put the figure at 80%.

    Among institutions, Planned Parenthood has the highest approval (45%) and Congress has the lowest (8%). Why don't reproductive rights advocates attack the anti-abortion terrorists with the same ferocity that the zealots exhibit in their ongoing campaign of harassment, violence and dishonesty? The truth is that the bible does not endorse the fundamentalist Christian assault on women's reproductive health.

    In fact, God is clearly pro-abortion.


    The imminent reversal of Roe v. Wade is a supreme betrayal.

    Reproductive tyranny is a linchpin of all totalitarian regimes - and theocracies. The root cause of the denial of reproductive rights is religion and its influence over our government, including our extremist Supreme Court.

    The battle to turn back the clock and recriminalize abortion is a religious crusade fueled by the zealous beliefs of a minority.

    Governors signing anti-abortion bans invariably invoke God. Trump, in pandering to his Christian nationalist base, vowed to nominate justices who would overturn Roe v. Wade. And his three appointees, joined by other extremists, are delivering.

    The Supreme Court’s expected ruling to abandon reproductive rights to state legislative whim will sow even more chaos and suffering, and is anathema to America’s Bill of Rights.

    Fundamental rights should not depend on one’s ZIP Code.

    Under the blinkered reasoning in Justice Alito’s leaked draft opinion overturning Roe v. Wade, other constitutional rights are imperiled, among them contraception, LGBTQ rights and marriage equality.

    The Establishment Clause - and its foundational principle of separation between state and church - is jeopardized by a court consistently privileging religion over civil rights.

    We cannot allow theocrats and minority rule to destroy human freedom and dignity, and eviscerate our godless Constitution. Secular voices must be heard if our republic is to survive.


    Christians are OK with the concept of their fictional God slaughtering babies.

    The bible is filled with stories about God slaughtering fetuses, babies and children. Also, if God controls everything, that means he also controls miscarriages. Seeing how there are more miscarriages than abortions every year, that would make God the world's biggest abortion provider.

    If babies are taken to Heaven, do they remain babies forever in Heaven. Does God change diapers?

    Helping the kids skip all the life and get right into perfect happy times. Should make the women saints not criminals

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